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 Post Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:32 pm 
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Swindon117 wrote:
One observation that 117 has produced was very early on in season one/two - I had Swindon who had around 5-7 pot players, no superstars, then very quickly the bigger clubs had 12+pot players and some superstars and no debt - not sure how that happened so quickly

A) people selling their pot players too cheaply
B) smaller clubs not valuing their pot players enough
C) the ability to see massive gains with pot players, several times I've trained pot players for 10 weeks and no gains so the thought of swapping for a worldie is appealing, but cash wise could only afford 1 per club ie crusaders getting Suarez or Swindon getting Vardy

S3 seems more balanced with the lower teams in the premiership and I have reasonable PV vs theirs

Not sure the 13 week ban would improve the game, but maybe a mixture so no transfers for 5 turns and new managers ban

Also would prefer a transfer committee so deals need a sanction as so many possible suspect transfers going through or a better log of the transfers so we can police and report it ourselves

Steven


I'm not sure how many of the bigger clubs had 12+ POT players, I know of Real Madrid but that's about it really and when you look at Real Madrid's POT players many of those aren't good enough to play first team football and might never be ready to play by season 6.

It's like having a collection of Ferrari's sitting on your drive way only to find you can't actually drive them because they won't start for whatever reason, looks great but that's about it.

Personally I think the proposed transfer ban has come about because of the situation at Real Madrid in 117. Yes Real Madrid look the bees knees but in reality while they look good on paper they're nothing special.

I won't knock Real Madrid on how he assembled so many POT players, he's an experienced manager, had a strategy to clear his debt and executed his strategy brilliantly i'll add.

Did some people let there POT players go too easily as you suggest in A and B? Of course they did and yes I agree something needs to be in place to protect against this which is why I suggest a POT player should not be allowed to be moved on unless the incoming player is worth £20m+ more than the outgoing player. Apply it for the first 13 weeks heck even the whole of season 1. This would protect new managers from losing a POT player for a Barcelona squad player and is something that could be applied to all games.

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 Post Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:53 pm 
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I offloaded Ince with pot from my team and got two players from bayern in return alonso and ribery both with low values both were star players and made a big difference to my derby team.
Both are ageing and many might say I cocked up but felt it was the right thing to do for the benefit of my team

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 Post Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:34 pm 
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liverpool wrote:
I offloaded Ince with pot from my team and got two players from bayern in return alonso and ribery both with low values both were star players and made a big difference to my derby team.
Both are ageing and many might say I cocked up but felt it was the right thing to do for the benefit of my team


Like you I went to Barcelona and swapped 2 POT players and cash fro Busquets, then went to Madrid and swapped 2 pot players and cash again for Kroos, then Bayern one POT player and another with cash for VIDAL. The my midfield consisted of Busquets AM, Vidal CM and Kroos at PL. So I was more than happy and so were the selling manager as they all reduced their debts with recruiting POT players and think this is the right thing to do. So to prevent managers from doing this is feel is wrong. Very wrong.

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 Post Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:29 am 
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Mark - Wolfsburg wrote:
liverpool wrote:
I offloaded Ince with pot from my team and got two players from bayern in return alonso and ribery both with low values both were star players and made a big difference to my derby team.
Both are ageing and many might say I cocked up but felt it was the right thing to do for the benefit of my team


Like you I went to Barcelona and swapped 2 POT players and cash fro Busquets, then went to Madrid and swapped 2 pot players and cash again for Kroos, then Bayern one POT player and another with cash for VIDAL. The my midfield consisted of Busquets AM, Vidal CM and Kroos at PL. So I was more than happy and so were the selling manager as they all reduced their debts with recruiting POT players and think this is the right thing to do. So to prevent managers from doing this is feel is wrong. Very wrong.


And yet you had a pop at me and Macca for our Messi deal in 114? When he got a very good POT player off me along with a pot and FLA both footed striker who was one of the games highest scorers and 95oa 36pv ?

This is why I agree completely with transparency and the ue system... with my deal for example was run through Ben and had been publicised on forum and WhatsApp with no issues mentioned by anyone.

I think deals involving POT players are too hard to get through without being legitimate so I have no problem with any of those kinda deals.

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 Post Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:45 am 
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DarthFritzl wrote:
Mark - Wolfsburg wrote:
liverpool wrote:
I offloaded Ince with pot from my team and got two players from bayern in return alonso and ribery both with low values both were star players and made a big difference to my derby team.
Both are ageing and many might say I cocked up but felt it was the right thing to do for the benefit of my team


Like you I went to Barcelona and swapped 2 POT players and cash fro Busquets, then went to Madrid and swapped 2 pot players and cash again for Kroos, then Bayern one POT player and another with cash for VIDAL. The my midfield consisted of Busquets AM, Vidal CM and Kroos at PL. So I was more than happy and so were the selling manager as they all reduced their debts with recruiting POT players and think this is the right thing to do. So to prevent managers from doing this is feel is wrong. Very wrong.


And yet you had a pop at me and Macca for our Messi deal in 114? When he got a very good POT player off me along with a pot and FLA both footed striker who was one of the games highest scorers and 95oa 36pv ?

This is why I agree completely with transparency and the ue system... with my deal for example was run through Ben and had been publicised on forum and WhatsApp with no issues mentioned by anyone.

I think deals involving POT players are too hard to get through without being legitimate so I have no problem with any of those kinda deals.


Dude it was made public knowledge which is why managers who wasn't in the game all knew about it. Just because it wasn't posted in whatsapp doesn't mean managers didn't say or think it, many prefer to avoid conflict in chats and on the forum especially in front of you and the other manager.

Don't shoot the messenger bud.

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Last edited by Math on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:54 am 
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Actually it was posted on WhatsApp, and no one disagreed with it. There have been far worse deals in ue.
Even recently in new game groups it's been brought up to gauge people's opinions and all agree it's a fine deal.

How is it a poor deal when he gets a top striker arguably better in goals scored etc.. along with another POT player that bettered his squad? My two players matched the valuation.

Yet, you did deals with 2 POT players plus cash which clearly means they were poor statistically in comparison to what you recieved and thus needed to top up the deal with money? But that's ok and legitimate..... stinks of hypocrisy.

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 Post Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:09 pm 
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DarthFritzl wrote:
Actually it was posted on WhatsApp, and no one disagreed with it. There have been far worse deals in ue.
Even recently in new game groups it's been brought up to gauge people's opinions and all agree it's a fine deal.

How is it a poor deal when he gets a top striker arguably better in goals scored etc.. along with another POT player that bettered his squad? My two players matched the valuation.

Yet, you did deals with 2 POT players plus cash which clearly means they were poor statistically in comparison to what you recieved and thus needed to top up the deal with money? But that's ok and legitimate..... stinks of hypocrisy.


You're just speculating on my deal squire. It's never been questioned. Your deal has and still remains to the point that people outside the game all know about it, anyway I'll end this as it's completely off topic.

The computer and UE decide deals, so that's it. But we all have opinions.

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Last edited by Math on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:43 pm 
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Not at all, I'm pointing out the laughable hypocrisy displayed here... and I actually misspoke on my original post... Juanmi was in fact 97oa 37pv with FLA and POT so again rendering your 'opinion' massively flawed.
You say your deals haven't been questioned but that's is an flawed assumption, I would honestly say 90% of deals have been questioned on various WhatsApp groups or on here.. the difference is they tend to have the decency to a) get facts correct
b) discuss with relevant parties

In regards to your deals and why I say your stance is hypocritical, is that in order to get a lets say an aging star like you did with lets say stats of 96oa 36pv. For you to offer two POT players with the need of adding cash too! They couldn't have been world beaters that you offered..

Now we compare that to my deal I got an aging star and offered two POT players, one of which included arguably one of the best strikers in the game.

And I'm going through my turns again... Juanmi as mentioned was 97oa 37pv both footed with FLA and POT.

So in the immortal words of Dillion Whyte "stop tarkin' rubbish!" ;) ;) ;) ;)

Or perhaps we could post our deals and compare for validity?

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 Post Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2017 1:18 pm 
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These posts your writing mark make it so obviously clear and for the whole forum to see exactly who you are.

And here's me thinking you were banned :roll:

For you to even question our deal makes it laughable considering who you are. I've never seen so many flawed deals before which involve yourself.

You seem to forget the deal you done with me when I was Arsenal and you talked me into selling one of my star players for cash because I was new :roll:

Maybe you should let UE know who you really are hey?!

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 Post Posted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:11 am 
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Martin B wrote:
Swindon117 wrote:
One observation that 117 has produced was very early on in season one/two - I had Swindon who had around 5-7 pot players, no superstars, then very quickly the bigger clubs had 12+pot players and some superstars and no debt - not sure how that happened so quickly

A) people selling their pot players too cheaply
B) smaller clubs not valuing their pot players enough
C) the ability to see massive gains with pot players, several times I've trained pot players for 10 weeks and no gains so the thought of swapping for a worldie is appealing, but cash wise could only afford 1 per club ie crusaders getting Suarez or Swindon getting Vardy

S3 seems more balanced with the lower teams in the premiership and I have reasonable PV vs theirs

Not sure the 13 week ban would improve the game, but maybe a mixture so no transfers for 5 turns and new managers ban

Also would prefer a transfer committee so deals need a sanction as so many possible suspect transfers going through or a better log of the transfers so we can police and report it ourselves

Steven


I'm not sure how many of the bigger clubs had 12+ POT players, I know of Real Madrid but that's about it really and when you look at Real Madrid's POT players many of those aren't good enough to play first team football and might never be ready to play by season 6.

It's like having a collection of Ferrari's sitting on your drive way only to find you can't actually drive them because they won't start for whatever reason, looks great but that's about it.

Personally I think the proposed transfer ban has come about because of the situation at Real Madrid in 117. Yes Real Madrid look the bees knees but in reality while they look good on paper they're nothing special.

I won't knock Real Madrid on how he assembled so many POT players, he's an experienced manager, had a strategy to clear his debt and executed his strategy brilliantly i'll add.

Did some people let there POT players go too easily as you suggest in A and B? Of course they did and yes I agree something needs to be in place to protect against this which is why I suggest a POT player should not be allowed to be moved on unless the incoming player is worth £20m+ more than the outgoing player. Apply it for the first 13 weeks heck even the whole of season 1. This would protect new managers from losing a POT player for a Barcelona squad player and is something that could be applied to all games.


Ok not really been on here as work has been incredibly busy but I will state things from the Real Madrid perspective.

Also for the record the deal for Kroos only involved 1 player with Potential so sorry Marko but not sure why you think I got 2 players from you.

The deficit at Real Madrid was £312m at the beginning of 117 and TBH i've never come out of the debt for more than 2 weeks. When I took over this side EVERYBODY wanted a piece of the Real Madrid pie and I couldn't deal with everyone but tried to be as fair as I could and dealt with only 1 player per club. This admittedly allowed me to choose my replacement from each side.

Going back to the original points that this topic is about, I have to disagree and say that there should not be a restriction on the number of weeks that clubs should be able to hold on to potential payers. The reason for this in my opinion is down to the extortionate levels of interest accrued every week due to the overdraft being so high.
I was paying in excess of £6,000,000 a week coupled with a £3,500,000 a week wage bill and other costs took my outgoings in excess of £11,000,000 before I had even bought or sold a player or even collected gate receipts and as you are all aware only generated from home games.

Even now despite increasing the capacity and condition of the stadium I still do not cover the wage bill of the squad. I have played in HFG's game 99,107,112 and 117 in which I have never seen any other side with a significant debt achieve success past season one to that which I have taken Real Madrid. Like I stated above, every manager old or "new" had the opportunity to deal with us in order to secure our better standard of players.

Martin has correctly pointed out that I am an experienced manager who likes to think that he knows what he's talking about. However, The Don & I have learnt from our previous mistakes in the games preceding 117 which have allowed us to put together the type of squad that we now have. I would far rather have a fleet of Ferraris than a shiny Bentley surrounded by Minis.

Whilst our manager at Dortmund does not feel that my team is as good as it looks on paper, it would appear that his vision is being tainted by the glare of my two shining and gleaming titles that have been won the previous 2 seasons.

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 Post Posted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 12:18 am 
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Jay wrote:
Martin B wrote:
Swindon117 wrote:
One observation that 117 has produced was very early on in season one/two - I had Swindon who had around 5-7 pot players, no superstars, then very quickly the bigger clubs had 12+pot players and some superstars and no debt - not sure how that happened so quickly

A) people selling their pot players too cheaply
B) smaller clubs not valuing their pot players enough
C) the ability to see massive gains with pot players, several times I've trained pot players for 10 weeks and no gains so the thought of swapping for a worldie is appealing, but cash wise could only afford 1 per club ie crusaders getting Suarez or Swindon getting Vardy

S3 seems more balanced with the lower teams in the premiership and I have reasonable PV vs theirs

Not sure the 13 week ban would improve the game, but maybe a mixture so no transfers for 5 turns and new managers ban

Also would prefer a transfer committee so deals need a sanction as so many possible suspect transfers going through or a better log of the transfers so we can police and report it ourselves

Steven


I'm not sure how many of the bigger clubs had 12+ POT players, I know of Real Madrid but that's about it really and when you look at Real Madrid's POT players many of those aren't good enough to play first team football and might never be ready to play by season 6.

It's like having a collection of Ferrari's sitting on your drive way only to find you can't actually drive them because they won't start for whatever reason, looks great but that's about it.

Personally I think the proposed transfer ban has come about because of the situation at Real Madrid in 117. Yes Real Madrid look the bees knees but in reality while they look good on paper they're nothing special.

I won't knock Real Madrid on how he assembled so many POT players, he's an experienced manager, had a strategy to clear his debt and executed his strategy brilliantly i'll add.

Did some people let there POT players go too easily as you suggest in A and B? Of course they did and yes I agree something needs to be in place to protect against this which is why I suggest a POT player should not be allowed to be moved on unless the incoming player is worth £20m+ more than the outgoing player. Apply it for the first 13 weeks heck even the whole of season 1. This would protect new managers from losing a POT player for a Barcelona squad player and is something that could be applied to all games.


Ok not really been on here as work has been incredibly busy but I will state things from the Real Madrid perspective.

Also for the record the deal for Kroos only involved 1 player with Potential so sorry Marko but not sure why you think I got 2 players from you.

The deficit at Real Madrid was £312m at the beginning of 117 and TBH i've never come out of the debt for more than 2 weeks. When I took over this side EVERYBODY wanted a piece of the Real Madrid pie and I couldn't deal with everyone but tried to be as fair as I could and dealt with only 1 player per club. This admittedly allowed me to choose my replacement from each side.

Going back to the original points that this topic is about, I have to disagree and say that there should not be a restriction on the number of weeks that clubs should be able to hold on to potential payers. The reason for this in my opinion is down to the extortionate levels of interest accrued every week due to the overdraft being so high.
I was paying in excess of £6,000,000 a week coupled with a £3,500,000 a week wage bill and other costs took my outgoings in excess of £11,000,000 before I had even bought or sold a player or even collected gate receipts and as you are all aware only generated from home games.

Even now despite increasing the capacity and condition of the stadium I still do not cover the wage bill of the squad. I have played in HFG's game 99,107,112 and 117 in which I have never seen any other side with a significant debt achieve success past season one to that which I have taken Real Madrid. Like I stated above, every manager old or "new" had the opportunity to deal with us in order to secure our better standard of players.

Martin has correctly pointed out that I am an experienced manager who likes to think that he knows what he's talking about. However, The Don & I have learnt from our previous mistakes in the games preceding 117 which have allowed us to put together the type of squad that we now have. I would far rather have a fleet of Ferraris than a shiny Bentley surrounded by Minis.

Whilst our manager at Dortmund does not feel that my team is as good as it looks on paper, it would appear that his vision is being tainted by the glare of my two shining and gleaming titles that have been won the previous 2 seasons.


Jay I think you may have mis-interpreted the point I was trying to make.

Your team was being used as an example of a big team having 12+ POT players, I couldn't think of another team that started so heavily in debt and had assembled a squad containing so many POT players so I used you as an example based on this perception that all the big teams got everything in 117 when in reality Real Madrid were probably the only team in this position and as I said in my previous post it's to your credit to have assembled Real Madrid in the way you have.

The point I was making though was that of all those POT players at Real Madrid on your hands, not all of them are good enough to play for your first team and might never be, so while it sounds great and fantastic to say Real Madrid have 12+ POT players I am trying to make the point that the big clubs got everything is a bit of a false statement, 12+ POT players doesn't mean 12+ world beaters, this is what I mean by nothing special in that all your POT players are not 39PV-102OA's.

A good comparison I can give you is when pointless stats are reeled out. For example last season Charlton won at Rotherham 4-1 in the league for the first time since 1963 a whopping 53 years..what a headline that sounds! Except the teams hadn't played for 52 of those 53 years. You see the point I make?

It's like judging teams on who has the highest OA and highest PV averages? Looks fantastic on paper but those teams might possibly be lacking in other factors such as EXP or other SA's, there's far more to a team than average age, PV and OA.

My vision has not been 'tainted' as you say, you have the trophies in the cabinet nobody can take away from you and which you have fully deserved. If you want some praise then i'll give it to you, you've played a blinder with Real Madrid and it's only a missing Champions League trophy of which you've been close to which has stopped you from playing Madrid to perfection, espcially compared to previous Real Madrid managers in previous HFG's.

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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 8:27 am 
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it would be nice to scrap whatsapp and text and mobile phone call deals in this game and just have all deals on the forum wont happen but it does mean we all have a chance to do deals and keeps the forum active as well.
nothing worse than a player going up for sale ,replying,waiting 2 days for an answer,then getting message sold on whatsapp.....

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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 1:09 pm 
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I wasn't on the WhatsApp chat for ages and really struggled to deal. I've done more deals on WhatsApp in one day than months on the forums.

Just the way it is

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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 1:48 pm 
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which sort of highlights the post as the forum is going nowhere as a result

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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:16 pm 
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it's a shame that whatsapp takes preference, but it's much easier to get deals done, ultimately it's the game not the forum that matters most, would I prefer to deals on the forum? yes, but, 95% deal on whatsapp, so no point missing out.

The one big drawback is we have micky and Cathcart on there professing undying love for each other's tiny man bits.

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 Post Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 6:42 pm 
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dunky wrote:
it's a shame that whatsapp takes preference, but it's much easier to get deals done, ultimately it's the game not the forum that matters most, would I prefer to deals on the forum? yes, but, 95% deal on whatsapp, so no point missing out.

The one big drawback is we have micky and Cathcart on there professing undying love for each other's tiny man

bits.


We are still talking about ue .....lol

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 Post Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:29 pm 
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I was only an whatsapp for a couple months a while back, but even then I didn't do one deal in the chat. All mine have been done with forum managers on the forum. I'm not in the chat simply because whatsapp is 90% non UE related chat and I don't wish to see graphic images or descriptions of fornication and the like. That just isn't me. But each to their own.

whatsapp will always be with us unless the managers decide to scrap making them which would then mean the forum is the only way to do deals, that's the only way you will get a forum buzzing daily again.

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 Post Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 5:05 pm 
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I still use the forum for deals as well as WhatsApp, with both having significant benefits!

However, I think many on WhatsApp would say it's the speed/instantancy of replies/negotiations that makes it more of an appealing medium.

The forum still has it's place though, with many managers not wanting to participate in group chats... also there is an almost nostalgic feel to the forum.

Perhaps the introduction of new threads run by managers could invigorate the forum?! I remember in 108 the forum was a hive of activity with so many brilliant sections run by the likes of Matt Upton, Darryl Saunders and Ian Hall... food for thought perhaps...

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 Post Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:01 pm 
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DarthFritzl wrote:
I still use the forum for deals as well as WhatsApp, with both having significant benefits!

However, I think many on WhatsApp would say it's the speed/instantancy of replies/negotiations that makes it more of an appealing medium.

The forum still has it's place though, with many managers not wanting to participate in group chats... also there is an almost nostalgic feel to the forum.

Perhaps the introduction of new threads run by managers could invigorate the forum?! I remember in 108 the forum was a hive of activity with so many brilliant sections run by the likes of Matt Upton, Darryl Saunders and Ian Hall... food for thought perhaps...


That's fair enough. I agree with what you said about new sections ect, On 117 I've taken it upon myself in the last fortnight to re-start the Forum Cup, re-name it and its given it a new lease of life with 32 sides now partaking in it. In addition to this I also load on my own German weekly write up with my view on each fixture, a hour with I've re-started, then weekly stats are loaded on also (4 different threads in fact with all that information) and to be honest other than the odd comment it hasn't really gathered that much interest. Sadly.
but I'm blaming some of this on the fact I was rebuffed when I asked for a new section to be added, so my threads are pretty much hidden away in general section.

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